Elevator - mode of transport?

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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby dipsydoodlenoodle » Thu Jun 11, 2009 9:14 am

There was an airbus the same model as the one that crashed made an emergency landing yesterday because a window in the cockpit got set on fire...They landed the plane safely and everyone was ok.....Stuff like that is only making the news because of the one that crashed.

captain_flynn wrote:with additional head or tail wind which makes abit of a difference too.


I went to Canada years ago and it took an hour less one way than the other for the winds.
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby Weasley » Thu Jun 11, 2009 12:21 pm

Urgh just hate turbulence and I know you can't do anything about it but I just hate that feeling of being thrown about 30,000 feet above the ground! I just have this fear that the plane will just drop out of the sky...it's a horrible feeling.
I am flying Virgin - I usually fly Virgin, I find the attendants very helpful when I start crying and getting hysterical!
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby Bel Bel » Thu Jun 11, 2009 1:19 pm

ah bless weasley, we will all be thinking of you :grouphug:
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby captainf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:07 pm

There was an airbus the same model as the one that crashed made an emergency landing yesterday because a window in the cockpit got set on fire...They landed the plane safely and everyone was ok.....Stuff like that is only making the news because of the one that crashed.


Yes, I believe it was a JetStar A330. I think they're part of Qantas. Unfortunately for the news i'd be surprised if the Cockpit window caught alight, if thats at all possible but i'm quite used to watching news reports speaking trash (im waiting for the day when they report that a British Airways Spitfire has encountered a problem and diverted) I'd take a guess that it was something electrical via the instrumentation. Again, I only heard it as breaking news so dont really know, but I bet it was probably extinguished inflight. Diversions are always carried out as a safety precaution. Which is a good thing.

I recall the news damning another aircraft type only about 9yrs ago after one crash.. what was it called?... oh yeah, Concorde.. and now thanks to poor public confidence after listening to thickos (or journos - all part of the same job) the plane is restricted to a museum. Sometimes abit of thinking and discretion is required.. well, if you have a brain.

I went to Canada years ago and it took an hour less one way than the other for the winds.


The jetstream causes that. If you're doing the UK - USA you're flying into the jetstream making the westbound longer.. if you're flying USA - UK you're flying with the jetstream and therefore the flight is shorter. BA are starting London City to new york soon with A318's.. the westbound flight will have a refuel stop in Shannon, the eastbound will be direct to London city with no refuelling stop for that very reason.

Urgh just hate turbulence and I know you can't do anything about it but I just hate that feeling of being thrown about 30,000 feet above the ground! I just have this fear that the plane will just drop out of the sky...it's a horrible feeling.
I am flying Virgin - I usually fly Virgin, I find the attendants very helpful when I start crying and getting hysterical!


Weasley, no problem. I understand that turbulence can be quite daunting but its really nothing to worry about. It gets abit bumpy sometimes but dont worry about it, aeroplanes are very robust and turbulence won't damage the plane. Aeroplanes have been successfully flying for about 106yrs now and the boffins that design them always take things like turb into account. Aeroplanes before certification are tested to destruction - in other words are built to withstand alot more than they will ever experience. Normally when a plane is being built they make a few test airframes to test for different things, one of the airframes never flies, but is tested on the ground (basically the one they break apart)

I think that we spoke of turbulence in a few private messages many months ago. I seem to recall that you said that you would print it off and read it inflight. Maybe it will help? Turbulence is great fun, the only trouble is that your stomach sensations can often get the better of you and make you think that its alot worse than it really is. Its okay though, planes are prepared for turbulence. Theres a specific speed to use (refered to as Vturb) that is flown during turbulence, the plane indeed gets bumped around abit but its nothing, its the unstable air mass passing by causing the plane to move up and down abit, but make no mistake the plane will never drop out of the sky. The wings sometimes drop side to side abit, but thats fine, as my instructor said to me - when the wing turns right, it will then counteract and turn left after in turbulence. Its very normal, very safe but it is a little inconvenience to passengers. When i'm flying through turbulence I quite like it and in some cases have ended up laughing due to the funny tummy sensation. In addition to this, on the calm days I fly with no turbulence I quite often find that I miss it :P Im someone who doesnt do fair ground rides. I enjoy flying and turbulence though. Always remember that eventhough you're in turbulence the Pilot's and even the flight management computers are still very much in control of the aeroplane.

Virgin are great and I assume you're either gonna be on the B747-400, A340-300 or A340-600.. all very good and safe aircraft. Virgin has never had a crash, in addition I can't recall reading anything about them having any minor issues in the last 10 years neither. They're one of the airlines I hope to fly for. :) They actually turn 25yrs old on June 21st. I'm just abit older than the airline having been born on June 12th of 84 :P
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby Weasley » Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:28 pm

Thanks Captain - yes Virgin are my favorite airline too...they seem to be able to cope with my outbursts more professionally than the other airlines I have been with - specifically Ryan Air (I really don't like them!)
The problem (and I hate this too) is that I'm not flying direct...I'm having a short stop over and continuing on with AA (American Airlines). I'm also not a big fan of these and I hate having to take off TWICE before I'm even at where I wanna be!
I know turbulence really shouldn't bother me THAT much...but it does. I mean, I've read a lot of stuff on all the technical things and how the plane won't fall out the sky but there was that plane crash last year in Madrid and the Air France one and don't even get me started on suicidal pilots...
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby captainf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:35 pm

Yes virgin are a very high standard airline. You will be in good hands with them. Dont worry. :)

I understand regarding to the change of flights. However, I have to ask, what is it about take off that you dont like? Do you dislike landing too?

The madrid crash I believe was down to the pilots not setting flaps? If so, very stupid error and one that not even a student pilot should of made. The AF one will be concluded but rest assured whatever went on there was extremely rare and unsual. As for suicidal pilots, I can only think of one confirmed case and a possible second, though the crews were not UK nor US. Dont worry about things like this. It rarely ever happens and most pilots who have committed suicide dont do it in a plane.

What specifically about turb is it that you dont like?
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby dipsydoodlenoodle » Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:03 am

captain_flynn wrote:
There was an airbus the same model as the one that crashed made an emergency landing yesterday because a window in the cockpit got set on fire...They landed the plane safely and everyone was ok.....Stuff like that is only making the news because of the one that crashed.


Yes, I believe it was a JetStar A330. I think they're part of Qantas. Unfortunately for the news i'd be surprised if the Cockpit window caught alight, if thats at all possible but i'm quite used to watching news reports speaking trash (im waiting for the day when they report that a British Airways Spitfire has encountered a problem and diverted) I'd take a guess that it was something electrical via the instrumentation. Again, I only heard it as breaking news so dont really know, but I bet it was probably extinguished inflight. Diversions are always carried out as a safety precaution. Which is a good thing.


The news did say it was extinguished but landed as a precautionary measure. The news also said it was the same model as the one that crashed, they did say who it was owned by but I don't remember who (it wasn't Air France).
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby dipsydoodlenoodle » Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:08 am

captain_flynn wrote: However, I have to ask, what is it about take off that you dont like? Do you dislike landing too?


My dad hates both take off and landing, and my bf hates them both but not as bad. I am surrounded by flying scaredy cats; the only part of take off I don't like so much is where the front wheel lifts off (I quite often expect the tail to hit the run way even though I know it won't happen).

We fly with work to Aberdeen and normally the planes are 20 seaters and they can be pretty bumpy with them being so small...they also seem to have stupidly strong breaks; I always slide off the seat upon landing (thank god for my seat belt); I don't seem to do that on bigger planes. It's quite funny watching other people slide as well; there is only ever 1 or 2 people slide.
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby Jess1234 » Fri Jun 12, 2009 11:31 am

I don't mind taking off so much but I really hate landing and I sometimes freak out over turbulence! My mum is terrible when it comes to flying though! I would much rather be on a bigger plane than on the little ones, they don't feel secure enough to me!
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby Weasley » Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:46 pm

Take off is HORRIBLE! I just wonder how that big heavy plane actually gets off the ground!! Plus I've seen Final Destination 1 and that freaked me out big time. Ever since I saw it I now check the tray tables when I get on and if the pin comes out...I'm off that plane like a shot!
Landing is different, I don't mind that as I know I'm coming down and will be on the ground again soon. After a 12-14 hour flight, that's the best feeling in the world!
I don't know...I just hate take off sooooo much. I hate that feeling when you just start to go up and your stomach drops, I hate it when the engine noise just stops and I hate it when the plane turns. I pretty much hate the whole thing!
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby liberalleague » Fri Jun 12, 2009 3:47 pm

I'm not at all scared of flying, just find it a generally unpleasant experience. I hate landing as my ears and the whole side of my face absolutely kills due to pressure! Honestly it's the most excrutiating pain I've ever experienced, and everyone around me is always suggesting me to swallow or yawn or suck on a sweet as if I haven't tried it already!!
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby captainf » Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:51 pm

Yeah, dipsy, the plane was an A330-200 of JetStar. Not heard much else on it so just like I thought it was probably insignificant - if the Air France A330 hadnt crashed before then you wouldnt of heard of the JetStar incident. Its just a minor inconvenience, abit like when you have a problem with your car - its fixed and then works fine.

We fly with work to Aberdeen and normally the planes are 20 seaters and they can be pretty bumpy with them being so small...they also seem to have stupidly strong breaks; I always slide off the seat upon landing (thank god for my seat belt); I don't seem to do that on bigger planes.


Which company do you normally fly with? Sounds like you travel on a STOL (Short Take Off or Landing) plane. They are designed to land at small airfields or remote areas which makes them great for small airlines in Cornwall, Scotland or even the RFDS (Royal Flying Doctor Service) in Australia. These planes are designed to take off in short distances and land and stop in short distances too. If you search for STOL planes on youtube you'll see how quickly they can stop! Alternatively maybe the aberdeen ATC might want the plane to vacate on to an early taxiway due to inbound traffic behind. So sometimes they may request you do that when you're flying final. Ive had that asked of me a few times, its no problem.

Take off is HORRIBLE! I just wonder how that big heavy plane actually gets off the ground!! Plus I've seen Final Destination 1 and that freaked me out big time. Ever since I saw it I now check the tray tables when I get on and if the pin comes out...I'm off that plane like a shot!


Dont worry about it, i've never seen Final Destination, but to be fair, I havent seen a film that has planes in that I havent picked holes in. Films make stuff up and over do things. Its fake. A faulty table tray has no relevance to the aeroplanes condition.

As for the take off, I wouldnt worry about it too much if I was you. The aeroplanes engines are extremely powerful and provide more than enough thrust to get the plane into the air and keep it there. The changing tone of the engine after take off is just the change of power required for climbing or flying at a constant altitude. For example when climbing a plane we'll use full power, however flying at a constant altitude requires less power so we'll reduce power abit to keep a balanced speed and altitude. Normally to help with the stomach sensation its best to try and keep situational awareness by looking out of the window. So if the plane does turn, look the to the side where you can see the ground as this will help you to see where you are (this helps to reduce the impact of the stomach sensations) Also I never have any milk before flying.

As for landing, im not sure why people think its scary. Can anyone clarify why its scary? I enjoy all motions of flying, however I must say I do enjoy it when im flying final approach, I enjoy the concentration and I also enjoy watching the runway getting closer while i'm guiding the plane down to it.

Liberalleague,
Normally swallowing does the trick, however none of the ideas you've tried have worked so im not sure what to suggest. Was you flying with a cold? Sometimes that can cause a problem. Alternatively, do you have any sinus or hearing problems? They may contribute to it. I flew (as pilot) once with a cold and found out why they advised me in my training manuals not to. :P
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby liberalleague » Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:56 pm

No I didn't have a cold or anything, it always happens to me! I've only had sinus problems once, but my dad has awful trouble with his sinus, so it's probably that!
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby captainf » Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:43 pm

Hmm it could be that. I've never really had a problem with it, only occasionally have my ears popped but normally thats during deteriorating weather.
Have you ever discussed it with your doctor? He might be able to help in some way as it cant be nice to fly with that problem for hours. Or does it only happen during climbing and descent? Thats normally when we have the greatest pressure changes.
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Re: Elevator - mode of transport?

Postby LME79 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 8:22 pm

liberalleague wrote:No I didn't have a cold or anything, it always happens to me! I've only had sinus problems once, but my dad has awful trouble with his sinus, so it's probably that!


Try taking Sudafed before you take off and have a nasal spray decongestant on board with you (obviously check with the airline whether you can carry it onboard prior to departure). It happened to my sister so badly on a flight to LA once that she thought her head was going to explode - a doctor on board managed to get a nasal spray from someone which did the trick.

EDIT: I'm also going to start a separate flying thread as it's obviously a point of interest with several of you recently (I guess it's coming up to holiday time soon!), so as we can keep it to one thread - we've noticed a few digressions recently! [-X :P
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