Abortions

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Re: Abortions

Postby spacegirl » Tue Jun 30, 2009 6:59 pm

hi snail, I actually read an article once about a woman who did just that, it was horrific. she got repeatedly pregnant to her husband who was cheating on her then aborted it in an attempt to make him pay attention to her - she said she thrived on the attention she got from her husband when she aborted their child and he was devastated. shocking, the poor woman must have been very ill.

i personally am very against abortions. I feel that everyone has the right to life, and once a child is conceived then the child has the same right to live as you and i whether the parents like it or not. now i do accept that there are situations whereby abortion is the only option, like if the woman or girl was raped, or if having the child would harm the mother, but even that i find hard to swallow. it's nothing religious or anything, just from a human rights point of view.

it is true, captain, that people are very casual about sex these days, but that's just the reality of society. i think where the problem lies is not the number of people having sex, it's a lack of education. a few leaflets handed out in schools and a really boring man or woman coming to schools to talk about the facts of life obviously just doesn't cut it if so many young girls are getting pregnant. as for older people who should know better, they know that an abortion is so easy to get so they get complacent. i know a girl who got pregnant for the 3rd time at 22 because she thought breastfeeding was a form of contraception (she's never had an abortion that i know of, but she's now 24 with 4 kids). i went to a catholic grammar and we didn't get sex ed until 15! obviously half the school was already at it by then!
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Re: Abortions

Postby captainf » Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:00 pm

it is true, captain, that people are very casual about sex these days, but that's just the reality of society. i think where the problem lies is not the number of people having sex, it's a lack of education. a few leaflets handed out in schools and a really boring man or woman coming to schools to talk about the facts of life obviously just doesn't cut it if so many young girls are getting pregnant.


Thing is spacegirl that although that is society today that doesnt mean its right. Its part of society today to accept that you might get stabbed when you go out, or even blown up in a terrorist attack, thing is its not right and there are some things in society that need to change for the better.

My school was very different to yours, I learnt about sex when I was about 8 or so. Each year after that in primary and then high school we were taught about sex and contraception. Thing is though I kinda find it difficult to understand why you say that people need more education on it? Its just for me personally unprotected sex = baby.. it seems a no brainer. This is where I think some people just need to take abit more responsibility for their actions rather than blame everything on society.

It wouldn't be on a conscious level at all. The reasons would be complex, and connected with the person's own circumstances and mental/emotional history.

But since contraception is, as a rule, easy, painless and largely free, and abortions are painful, time-consuming, traumatic, and physically damaging, it's clear that someone who repeatedly puts themselves through that is not simply being careless.


Hm I see thats very interesting. Never thought of looking at it like that before but although I can see the possibility in the theory I dont think it necessarily stands for all girls.
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Re: Abortions

Postby dipsydoodlenoodle » Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:58 am

captain_flynn wrote:My school was very different to yours, I learnt about sex when I was about 8 or so. Each year after that in primary and then high school we were taught about sex and contraception. Thing is though I kinda find it difficult to understand why you say that people need more education on it? Its just for me personally unprotected sex = baby.. it seems a no brainer. This is where I think some people just need to take abit more responsibility for their actions rather than blame everything on society.


I think you were probably one of the ones who recieved a lot of education. I never did. When I was in middle school, we got separate sex education to the boys...i.e periods and such (we were 11), then in high school (13+) there was sex education weekly/monthly I think (although I left that high school in the first year and I moved schools and I don't ever remember getting sex education at my new school.
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Re: Abortions

Postby Jess1234 » Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:45 am

wow captain_flynn you seem to have had a much better sex education than I had. We had very little sex education at my school from what I can remember. I think it varies from school to school, so some people get much better sex education than others.

Personally I am against abortions, like spacegirl I believe that everyone has the right to life. I think that if someone doesn't want a child, surely having it adopted would be better than aborting the child, there are so many couples out there who are desperate for children and willing to adopt. I do think that people who have repeated abortions must have something psychologically wrong with them.
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Re: Abortions

Postby spacegirl » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:21 am

captain i absolutely agree - because it's a reality of society doesn't necessarily make it right, however it is a reality the same way as there's violence and wars and it's better to do something about it rather than just reflect on how wrong it is. i'm not really blaming society, i'm just saying that's how it is. you say things have to change for the better, it is my opinion that things would change for the better if kids were taught at a young age the risks associated with sex. things will only change for the better if action is taken. what do you suggest?

for you unprotected sex = baby, quite obviously that isn't the case for everyone if there are so many unplanned pregnancies in the uk especially among young people.

people do need to take responsibility for their actions, i'm in complete agreement with that, and that is one of the reasons I am against abortion - I believe that if you're going to have sex you should accept the consequences. however, these 13/14 year old girls are children, and aren't old enough to accept responsibility for their actions. they are too young and immature to realise the ramifications if they do become pregnant, which is why i feel that more can be done in schools and in the home to make the kids aware. your school obviously had a very good sex ed programme, that isn't the case in all schools, it is still seen as quite taboo, which is ridiculous, and THAT is where i blame society.
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Re: Abortions

Postby Bel Bel » Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:12 pm

I think after one you should get serious sex education discussion
twice conselling and sex ed
three timws conselling, sex ed and a warning if it happens again within two year you will have a forceable hysterectomy you can't have any kids at all. If you can't prove responsibility to yourself you aren't fit to bring up a kid
Harsh I know but i know a woman who had four kids and several abortionsa and all the kids were neglected and she never learnt her lesson and the hosital told her they had to give her a hysterectomy at the last abortion, I don't think it's true i think they were sick to death of her
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Re: Abortions

Postby snail » Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:42 pm

Good grief, this isn't Nazi Germany, we can't go around forcibly sterilising people we don't think are fit to breed :o :o :o
What if it's a young person with mental health problems, and later in life they get better and want to have children in a stable relationship?

I agree that in some situations it might be advisable to get a court order to forcibly apply a LARC method - implant, coil etc, so that the woman can't get pregnant for the next five years (unless it is removed). This could legitimately be considered part of her own mental health treatment, as well as safeguarding potential children. I don't know if this is possible at the moment under our laws: I've never heard of it being done.

Everybody has their own feelings about when a pregnancy becomes a child, but for non-biology types, it's worth pointing out that a fertilised egg is not in any way a person, or anything like a person. It is a cell that has the potential to become a person. It is a fusion of the egg and sperm, both of which were living cells in exactly the same way before they fused.
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Re: Abortions

Postby captainf » Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:44 pm

Interesting, I always assumed everyone else got as good sex ed as me. Interesting though as I went to a school where I as a white person was the minority and alot of the kids in my school were of ethnic origin. This required consent to be given by parents to watch the sex ed videos and be in the sex ed lessons. Infact our parents had to watch them first.

I suppose my own opinion just stands that everyone is responsible for their own actions. I would of never had sex when I was that young and I held my virginity until I was 21 but I also understand now that I had alot better sex ed than most here so I suppose that makes my point ineffectual.
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Re: Abortions

Postby Bel Bel » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:08 pm

Snail if someone has mental health issues thats completely different but that would get picked up if they went for the conseeling so then they could be treated differently
I talk about the type of girls that use abortion as a method of contraception
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Re: Abortions

Postby rufio89 » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:12 pm

I think an important part of sex-education is raising girls self esteem.

I know when I was younger, I slept with a couple of people (including when I lost my virginity) because I was too afraid to say no. Not because they pressured me into anything, or because they were over-pushy, but because I felt that if I didnt have sex with them, they wouldnt like me anymore. They didnt make me feel that way on purpose, but I had very low self esteem.

I know people who havent used contraception for the same reasons. They're too afraid to say "stop, put on a condom".

Stupid, perhaps, but self-esteem issues do different damage to what people realise.
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Re: Abortions

Postby LemonJuice87 » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:49 pm

Someone said something about having the baby adopted if the child wasnt wanted.
That could be one of the most emotionally draining things ever.

I got pregnant at 19, i was on the pill and using condoms. I had my 7 day break and got my period as normal for about 5 months. Then i started getting fat and felt this weird butterfly sensations in my belly. I went ot the doc and he confirmed i was pregnant. I told the baby's Dad and he went mental TELLING ME the only option was Abortion! I could of smacked him. I told him it wasnt an option as i didnt agree with them. Then he said Adoption was the only other REAL answer.
I would have to of gone through another 4 months of carrying this baby, labour, been knocked out and having a C-Section and a big scar and a few months recovering with nothing to show for it!!
The real answer, is facing up to what you have created. The consequence's of having un-protected sex!!

Then you sit there every single day for the rest of your life wondering what your child looks like, acts like, what they are doing, wether they are ok with the family you gave them too.

Personally i would never do that. I am quite happy with my beautiful 2 year old daughter, even if she doesnt have a father.

I dont agree with abortions, i have never had one, and i never will, UNLESS the pregnancy is likely to cause me some serious damage or kill me.
I would have difficulty having abortion if *toch wood* i was raped. But i think that would hurt Mr. LemonJuice more. But with Technolagy these days, i can find out if the baby is Mr. LemonJuice's or the rapist's. Then i would give my baby up for adoption if it wasnt Mr. LemonJuice's.

I don't believe in having abortions just because the poor kid isnt wanted. Tough, deal with it! I did.
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Re: Abortions

Postby rufio89 » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:56 pm

LemonJuice87 wrote:I don't believe in having abortions just because the poor kid isnt wanted. Tough, deal with it! I did.


I pretty much agree with that LemonJuice, only it sounds better coming from you because I cant said "I did", and I dont know how I'd react in that situation.
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Re: Abortions

Postby RagDoll » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:58 pm

I agree with that stance in principle, but my only issue is that some people have children and still don't really 'deal with it'. They don't raise the child the way it should be raised (for whatever reason) and in that case I think it'd be better if the pregnancy had been terminated.
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Re: Abortions

Postby Bel Bel » Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:28 pm

i can't agree on the rape side of it
I do not want to bring a child into the world who is the product of rape
Yes you can give them up for adoption but one day they might come to find you and ask why you gave them up
You be truthful and what will that do to them, you lie and what will that do to them?
The rapist will already have damaged me I would not allow that damge to grow and cause me more hurt to give up a child which is partly mine and damage the child because i gave it up. I couldn't keep it because I know I couldn't love it as mine becasue i didn't choose the baby and it would always remind me of what happened
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Re: Abortions

Postby captainf » Thu Jul 02, 2009 4:57 pm

Gotta say I agree with Bel Bel. Imagine having a child after being raped, giving them up for adoption only to have them come by 18yrs later, that will just dig up past memories that are better left in the past.
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